Orthodox hierarchs attend U.S. Catholic bishop assembly to show intimacy of churches

Baltimore, November 17, 2021

Photo: assemblyofbishops.org Photo: assemblyofbishops.org     

A group of Orthodox hierarchs from various jurisdictions in America attended the opening of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops’ (USCCB) November General Assembly in Baltimore yesterday, at the invitation of the Catholic Archbishop José H. Gomez.

This marks the first time in the history of the USCCB that Orthodox hierarchs have participated in their plenary session, reports the Assembly of Canonical Orthodox Bishops of the United States of America.

As the chairman of the Orthodox Assembly of Bishops, Archbishop Elpidophoros of the Patriarchate of Constantinople’s Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America addressed the Catholic hierarchs. He was introduced by Catholic Bishop David P. Talley, who explained that the Orthodox bishops were invited in order to demonstrate the “closest intimacy” between the Orthodox and Catholic churches that was declared in the Second Vatican Council.

In turn, Abp. Elpidophoros declared: “I would like to share my heartfelt joy to be with you today, my brother bishops of the USCCB, for the first time in the history of our Sister Churches’ relation in this country.”

Of course, Abp. Elpidophoros made sure to praise Patriarch Bartholomew, the personal focal point of the Patriarchate of Constantinople’s mission in the world.

In closing, he states: “I am convinced that the future and mission of Catholic-Orthodox relations in the U.S.A. is to continue to bear witness to God’s presence in the world, faithful to the Spirit of Jerusalem that we received as a legacy.”

Abp. Elpidophoros was accompanied by Archbishop Daniel of Constantinople’s Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the U.S.A., Bishop Maxim of the Serbian Orthodox Church in the Americas, and Archbishop Alexander of the Orthodox Church in America.

Follow us on Facebook, Twitter, Vkontakte, Telegram, WhatsApp, MeWe, and Gab!


Editor11/29/2021 12:10 pm
Raphael: That is just it. Everyone who schisms thinks they've done the right thing, or they wouldn't have done it. But when the OCU people begin to realize that they don't really have autocephaly, that that are completely dependent on the Phanar, that the Church they left (or were never a part of) is the real, canononical, autonomous Church of Ukraine, and that if they join it they will be with Christ and with their own people, while also coming into canonical communion with the rest of the Orthodox Churches, then they might want to make the move. The Church should be ready to receive them. Sure, some of them have moral issues which is the reason many clergy schism--so as not to face suspension from their canonical bishops. But they can be dealt with individually. They are lost sheep. And we are supposed to seek the lost sheep. Have you read the Gospel lately?
Raphael11/29/2021 5:00 am
Editor: It's interesting that you completely evaded the first part of my comment, focused on the "slapping" and started to twist my words! I'll ask the question one more time, and since you are a defender of the Russian Church no matter what they do, please go ahead and answer: what do you mean by “repent and come back into the canonical fold” please explain how that can happen according to your understanding? They already consider themselves “in the fold” because of the planar, so how can they “come back”? What do they need to repent of?
Editor11/28/2021 3:05 pm
Raphael: Are you suggesting we shun people, like the Amish do? St. Nicholas was a bishop. He slapped Arius in the face because Arius was stubborn in his heresy. Also, this happened at an ecumenical council. But we don't go around slapping heretics or schismatics everywhere. Especially if we are not saints. If a person wants to repent and leave his heresy or schism, then we accept them back. "Speak the Truth in love". We have to speak the truth, but not forget about the love.
Raphael 11/27/2021 9:41 pm
Editor: what do you mean by “repent and come back into the canonical fold” please explain how that can happen according to your understanding? They already consider themselves “in the fold” because of the planar, so how can they “come back”? I suppose St. Nicholas was a Roman Catholic crusader in your opinion when he slapped Arius in the face? What about St. Maximus the confessor, who refused the compromise? You have ascribed some very serious heresies to these groups, and now you want to backtrack? This is sickening!
Editor11/27/2021 8:11 pm
Raphael: Don't forget: We are Christians. Pat. Kirill didn't say he would concelebrate with them, he only said he would be open to dialogue. That is not a capitulation. We are Orthodox Christians, and don't fight like Medieval Catholics and Anabaptists. If people repent and want to come back into the canonical fold, we should be ready with open arms. Sinners are also welcome--that is what the Church is for--to help sinners be healed. If there is a wound, we try to heal it, not pick the scab. You forget that Ukrainians would also like their own people to come back and stop fighting.
Raphael 11/27/2021 7:01 pm
Editor: are you seriously asking that question after all the things you have posted on this website? If P. Kirill just capitulates to Bartholomew’s evil after all the bloodshed, violence, claims by your website of heresy on the part of PB and the “graceless schismatics” as well as the exposing of the phanars global connections through the so called “archons”, and the homosexual bishops within the graceless Ukrainian community, then P. Kyrill has betrayed us all. If they repent of all of sins you have accused them off and enter the church CORRECTLY, then that is different, but that is not what P. Kirill is saying! It appears that he is ready to bow down to the enslaved Turks! God help us!
Editor11/27/2021 5:56 pm
Anonymous: What do you consider controversial or problematic about Pat. Kirill's words? Why shouldn't we leave the door of communication open for the schismatics should they decide to repent?
Anonymous11/27/2021 2:03 pm
To all who have been defending Patriarch Kyril, what do you think about this? https://spzh.news/en/news/84163-patriarkh-kirill-nazval-uslovije-dlya-dialoga-s-ukrainskimi-raskolynikami
Raphael11/27/2021 2:55 am
Mikhail is 100% correct; I would have no problem saying everything I wrote in our exchange to your face! But it obviously wouldn't do any good! You want to tall about Respect? Maybe P. Bartholomew should have respected His Holiness P. Kirill and spoken to him first? Maybe he should have respected the Ukrainians and listened to the overwhelming majority of orthodox Christians that reject neo-Nazis nationalism clocked in religion? Maybe, just maybe, he should have respected the rules of the Holy Church, the Ecumenical councils, the rudder and the TEACHINGS OF THE HOLY FATHERS before he committed his hideous crime in Ukraine! Maybe he should have begged his brother bishops to come together and discuss the "poor schematics" that he allegedly "saved"? David, please pluck the plank out of your own eye and the eye of your leader P.B. before you judge those of us committed to the truth! May God help you, and open your eyes to see that you are defending evil and crime against Christ and His Holy Church.
Afanassy11/25/2021 9:56 am
Article: "ORTHODOX HIERARCHS ATTEND U.S. CATHOLIC BISHOP ASSEMBLY TO SHOW INTIMACY OF CHURCHES".-- "Intimacy of Churches"?? -- How can the true Apostolic Orthodox Faith have "intimacy" with Heresy, as was declared, with anathema, by the 14th Council of 1583, to be the official status of the Papist organization -- https://orthodoxwiki.org/Sigillion_of_1583. ===================
Andrew11/24/2021 3:50 pm
David, I agree with some of what you say. I have commented on some RC blogs and instead of disagreeing with what I say, I have had people resorting vitriolic personal insults. As regards to Patriarch Bartholomew, I disagree with what you say. You are entitled to your opinion, as is everyone commenting here. As some have already pointed out, the situation is quite serious and should not be ignored. I have no problem with you personally. We do do each other. We can agree to disagree, without any personal animosity.
Mikhail11/24/2021 3:01 pm
David, I believe everyone here who is critical of your opinions, would tell you the same thing to your face. We are looking at the reality. We have a Patriarch who is out of control. He created a nationalist schismatic "church" in Ukraine which persecutes the canonical Church, and he does not give a hoot. He believes he is the first without equals and the leader of all Orthodox Christians worldwide. His Archbishop in America is his primary sychophant and almost every decision the AB makes is opposed to the Orthodox phronema. We are sorry that you are upset that we are exposing the reality of the situation. We don't like it either. But we are not going to pretend that everything is okay. At some point, you are going to have to accept that your jurisdiction is in serious trouble.
David11/24/2021 1:54 am
One need only look at this exchange to understand why no Council or dialogue is possible right now. Dialogue can only occur when there is mutual respect. I have a simple rule when posting on the internet: I say nothing that I wouldn't say to a person's face. I write as I speak. Do you talk like that at coffee hour? This isn't about "sensitive feelings." This is about the right way and wrong way to talk about someone, and to someone. The internet and partisan political discourse has horribly warped how we talk to each other. Do you think the folks at your local Greek Orthodox parish would appreciate this kind of talk? The Editors commented that they wouldn't want to alienate "the good people" of the Ecumenical Patriarchate. I contend that this kind of talk (and these kinds of articles) DOES EXACTLY THAT, as well as sow an ethos of disdain and contempt, all in the name of "being right." If this was just another blog, it wouldn't matter. But this is a blog from one of our monasteries, a rather prominent one. It doesn't exactly send the right message. HAH Bartholomew may very well be wrong. Very wrong. But if he is to be condemned for sowing division in the Church, he won't be there alone. The solution to division is not more division. I would like to thank the editors of this blog for their kindness in allowing me to post. I ask forgiveness of anyone I may have offended.
Anonymous11/24/2021 1:22 am
Dionysius, I appreciate your response. I agree that most of the GOA bishops here in America are corrupt and under their globalist masters, however I know for a fact that at least one is not. Let's not throw them all under the bus. Many other hierarchs are also under their spell. Recently Patriarch Kryil was congratulating Metropolitan Hilarion (the head of the Department of External Church Relations of the MP) and was referencing his own spiritual father, Metropolitan Nikodim, who they all still revere to this day. If you don't know about him, do some research. I assure you, he is still an ecumenist, yet we continue to pray for him. As far as Patriarch Kyril defending the catastrophe that occurred in the Ukraine - of course! He's protecting his interests. Did he not go into other territories and start churches there as well? As you brought up the union with ROCOR, are you aware that part of their agreement was that MP was not allowed to start any new churches or monasteries here in the states since this agreement? Yet, they have done just that. I appreciate you trying to educate me on the status of ROCOR, which makes me think that you believe that I am in an EP church. Thanks, however I have been in ROCOR for 30+ years and probably know alot more about the inner workings than you want to imagine, as I have three family members who are clergy (my husband being one of them). I stand by my previous message, pray for everyone! Even those we think are a lost cause can repent before their end. Let God be their judge and just do your job as a Christian and pray for everybody!
Andrew Roberts11/24/2021 1:17 am
David, the point that I was trying to make, is that Pope Francis and Patriarch Bartholomew are both to blame in their roles of causing division, within their respective spheres. They seem to have more concern for pandering to the zeitgeist than for the people they are supposed to shepherd. It has all been highly politicised and has polarised the faithful. All this conservative/tradionalist verses liberal/progressive in my mind belongs to the sphere of party politics and sunders the Body of Christ. Patriarch Bartholomew’s autocratic actions regarding the Ukrainian situation is outrageous and if not checked by an eocumenical council, may well lead to schism. One example of Pope Francis’ stepping beyond the bounds of his authority is his unilateral decision to alter the Lord’s Prayer. What arrogance! It seems to me that we are largely being sold out by our religious and political leaders. By jumping to extremes of either side is not a choice that is helpful. Although it is difficult in these turbulent times, I think it best to try and tread the royal path and veer neither to the left, nor the right.
Dionysius 11/23/2021 9:14 pm
Anonymous: I agree with you that Patriarch Kyrill does have ecumenical leanings, but we have to remember that he and the Patriarch of Serbia were the only ones that stood up against the false council of 2016, and saved us from Bartholomew's evil plans. The Turkish bishops are some of the most evil people that this world has ever seen, and I say this because I know many of them personally! They are not all as I described above, but the majority of the Phanar's bishops in North America are as I described. They are not people who "turn the other cheek" and they DO NOT forgive anyone! Trust me, these people are so vindictive and set on vengeance. Anyone who dares to oppose their will, gets on their hitlist and they WILL get their revenge! When you oppose them, you oppose their masters; George Soros, Bill gates, Barack Hussein Obama and all the other globalist elitist children of satan! Joseph Stalin has more Christian compassion and mercy than these people! As Holy archangel Michael said "may the Lord rebuke" all of satan's servants! Also, anyone that has been a part of ROCOR before and after their union with Moscow can tell you that the union has not had a positive affect on ROCOR. Their commitment to upholding the true teachings and holy traditions of the Holy Orthodox faith is slowly deteriorating and ROCOR is just not the same as it was before, and it grieves us (that have seen it happen) greatly! I personally love Holy Russia and consider P. Kyrill to be one of the best Patriarchs that we have today. He was the only one that came to the rescue of the suffering Christians in the Middle East that were being butchered by the western backed "freedom fighters" (ISIS) under the godless obama, and I for one will never forget that. He encouraged our brother in the faith President Putin to defend the Christians and fight for freedom. Russia has sacrificed a lot for the sake of truth and righteousness, and we love her for it! We acknowledge and know how much the Russians have sacrificed, and I pray for P. Kyrill, President Putin and all of the Russian people often. May God bless Holy Russia! Thank you!
sherlock_holmes11/23/2021 7:36 pm
Motto: If you are a sinner, then you are my brother ( Elder Gabriel )...I agree 109 % with Anonymous. Nothing to add. Because of the deadly virus of ecumenism, many in our Church got blurry minds and have become uncleaned spirits, as the Holy Fathers say. In this state, it is hard to understand the realities or the consequences of our actions.
Anonymous11/23/2021 3:30 pm
This is becoming a little ridiculous! This is not a fight between EP vs MP, more of a fight between good vs evil. You all should stop bickering about the churches and acting like cheerleaders for each jurisdiction. My very holy and enlightened spiritual father explained that there is corruption in all churches as well as good and faithful people in all churches. We need to pray for those who are showing their corruption for a return to the truth and not let the wolves who put on sheep's clothing fool us! I don't agree at all with Patriarch Bartholomew and the course of action he has taken. However, why can't you all admit that Patriarch Kyril also has been on an ecumenical path for years? Do you think this has changed? Let's stop arguing and a pointing finger and just pray for all of our hierarchs and the faithful in all jurisdictions, as true Orthodox Christians are charged to do!
Raphael11/23/2021 6:36 am
David, it seems to us that what you mean is this: "be my brothers and sisters by never pointing out any wrongdoings by the EP, help me affirm my self-righteous defense of heresy and Christian bloodshed, and please please don't trigger my sensitive feelings" We can't do that David! Because to pretend that your Turkish patriarch is acting like a Christian would mean that we would have to deny the truths that we see happening and to pretend that his diabolical actions are actually done out of ignorance, when he continues to make the same "well intentioned" mistakes over and over and over again. We are COMMANDED to judge by their fruits and to "BEWARE OF WOLVES IN SHEEPS CLOTHING!" Matthew 7:15. When a man acts like a wolf, speaks like a wolf and attacks like a wolf, then that person is a wolf! We Orthodox Christians must also protect ourselves from heresy and false teachings as commanded by Christ, His Apostles and the Holy Fathers! We can not cater to your feelings, and simply change reality to help you affirm your false and unfounded faith in Bartholomew. We would not be doing you service, by helping you believe your erroneous thoughts. Sorry Dave! Also, let me quote your earlier words "calling it nonsense doesn't make it so"! Saying that Elder Ephraim's monasteries have good relationships with the Turkish Bishops doesn't make it so, and is pure fiction based upon your fantasies! The reality is -as I previously stated- that to this day they use the term "Ephraimites" for any Orthodox Christian within their own jurisdiction that tries to follow the authentic spiritual tradition of the holy fathers, which is another proof of their hatred of true Orthodox Christianity. Their false gospel of hellenism, globalism and humanism is a diabolically inspired teaching, so stop trying to convince people WHO CAN READ that they are true shepherds of God's flock. Unlike you, I will try to address every one of your points, so pertaining to what you said about St. Paisios of Mount Athos: St. Paisios did not launch an attack against St. Joseph the Hesychast nor did he try to murder him, but prayed to God to enlighten him, and show him if he was making incorrect judgment, and God did show him, but in the case of your Turkish bishops they tried to destroy Elder Ephraim not because they thought he was delusional, but because they considered him a threat to their goals and worldly ambitions. They were and are to this day concerned about the monasteries taking away their laity ($$), and teaching them authentic things like, oh I don't know, the IMPORTANCE OF CONFESSION!! Think about that David, they are threatened by people learning that they need to confess! God help us! Is this Orthodoxy? Finally, and I say this respectfully, you should really learn how to read without any preconceived ideas and to make proper comparisons. A fanatical Muslim Turk deciding who will be the next "first without equals" is not the same as the Holy Serbian Church fighting to maintain a Christian presence in the land that your globalist government stole from them and gave to Muslims, and if you think that there is a similarity then it explains why you think PB is a well intentioned man! By the way, have you never heard "the road to hell is paved with good intentions"? However, if you take some time to study P.B's motivation for his evil work in Ukraine you will see that he was ordered by Mike Pompeo and the DOD to commit his evil, and was "compensated" very nicely by Petroshenko (40 + Mill US $!). He didn't listen to anyone except his greed, his ambition and his handlers! He certainly did not listen to the millions of Ukrainians that were peacefully living in Ukraine. BTW: We DO NOT consider the OCU to be ORTHODOX, nor do we care if you (or your kind) consider the TRUE Church of Ukraine "brothers and sisters"! Cane also killed Abel, and your leader kills my brothers and sisters in Christ! He shares the same spirit as muhammed! God forgive him, and you for defending him!
David11/23/2021 6:13 am
It is interesting that you should mention the Catholic conversation, Andrew. I don’t know if anybody is paying attention, but there is a full on meltdown occurring in the Catholic “Traditionalist” media over the Latin Mass restrictions, COVID conspiracies, et al. Zealotry has run amok, and some if its prominent figures have publicly burned out and begun lamenting how toxic it has become. I would say that Orthodox internet media is in a healthier state, but the same disease that seems to have infected Catholic “trad media” can also be found among us also. How is it that any defense of the Ecumenical Patriarchate, no matter how qualified or nuanced it may be, provokes such a visceral and often nasty reaction? Why are Bishops who were praised as lions of Orthodoxy last week, now denounced as heresiarchs over their views on COVID? Whole jurisdictions, with hundreds or thousands of people are dismissed as “modernists” or even worse. Is Orthodoxy a faith, or a political opinion? The editors of this website have been very gracious and posted my comments, despite our disagreements. The Catholic “trad media” is having to come to grips with the reality that “hating Pope Francis” has overtaken their Faith. Perhaps a similar reflection on HAH Bartholomew is in order.
Mikhail11/23/2021 2:10 am
"Maybe we should let things unfold and see what happens" We've been watching Bartholomew's nightmare unfold for a few years. The result is the confiscation of UOC Churches and the beating of elderly and women by nationalist thugs. But David continues to be an obedient apologist.
Mikhail11/22/2021 10:22 pm
Well Dave...Calling yourself "first without equal" is heresy. And creating a "church" from laymen to tear Ukraine apart is schism. So you figure it out.
S.Marley11/22/2021 8:41 pm
It seems to me that the doctrine of "first among equals", calling priests "father" and elevating church hierarchy to unreasonable levels of praise including the wearing of crown-like hats is the result of the Roman Catholics infiltration of the Eastern Orthodox Christian Church during the ROMAN CATHOLIC crusades...which went on for hundreds of years. Your either equal...or not equal...first among equals suggests some level of superiority. Jesus counseled/warned against this type of elevation of oneself or others...into a position of moral superiority...and the papacy is the result of ignoring the council of Christ. The Eastern Orthodox Church must cleanse itself of this legacy of the Catholic Crusades.
David11/22/2021 1:49 am
Mikhail: Nobody has condemned the Ecumenical Patriarchate for heresy and schism. Not even the Moscow Patriarchate has done so. You seem to be wanting to get ahead of our bishops on this matter (and others as well). Synodality cuts both ways, and deference to our Bishops is the right thing to do on this. I'm not going to spit fire at Bishops who disagree with me, or heckle bishops over their "vaccine stance" and I encourage you to do the same. Zealotry is something we want to avoid, is it not?
David11/22/2021 1:41 am
Raphael: I'm not asking for "pity." I'm asking for fellow Orthodox brothers and sisters to act like fellow Orthodox brothers and sisters. For the record: The people of the UOC-MP are also brothers and sisters. My point? Let give you the TLDR version: It isn't just HAH Bartholomew who is maligned in some of these hit pieces AND Good men can make bad decisions (sometimes really bad ones). That doesn't mean they necessarily cease to be good men. HAH Bartholomew IS listening to the Ukrainians, but according to the people around here, they are the "wrong Ukrainians." Who to believe in a nasty divorce or a blood feud? Maybe we should let things unfold and see what happens, and pray for EVERYONE involved. That is my position on Ukraine, if you were interested. PS. "First without Equals" is not a title, it is an out of context quote ripped from a larger point that Archbishop Elpidophoros was making about the EXERCISE of the EP's canonical privileges, NOT THE MAN HIMSELF------The EP and Archbishop Elpidophoros are quite friendly with Elder Ephraim's Monasteries. That wasn't always the case, but again, good men can make mistakes. St. Paisios also believed that St. Joseph the Hesychast and his brotherhood were delusional zealots, but repented after reading St. Joseph's journals--------The EP remains in Turkey for the same reason the Serbs remain in Kosovo.
Andrew11/21/2021 11:26 pm
The dialogue here seems to be descending into personal opinion; one against the other, causing inner and outer division. Some taking sides either for or against the EP.’ There is the same sort of dialogue going on amongst the RC, regarding Pope Francis. In both cases I think Pope Francis and the EP, for whatever reasons have abandoned the faith for the zeitgeist and are encouraging others to do the same, in the false and distorted undertaking of love for others. Current geo politics and relevance have been put ahead of the truth. Being liked and honoured by the world and self aggrandisement are put above faithfulness to the Lord Jesus Christ.
Jason11/21/2021 9:47 pm
Steve, there is a great book that you should read: "Teaching Critical Thinking to Third Graders" by Professor Edward D'Angelo, written in 1978. It will help you learn how to read with an honest and critical disposition rather than being predisposed to error and fallacy in your thought process. Honesty is a Christian virtue, and I wish you the best in acquiring it, since at present, it is clear that you are struggling in that area!
Raphael11/21/2021 9:11 pm
Steve: "Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish." ― Euripides, The Bacchae
Mark11/21/2021 9:03 pm
James: You mean the same St. Mark of Ephesus that attended the council of Florence, but didn't bow down to the pope, or kiss his hand? The St. Mark of Ephesus that did not sign over the church of Christ to the latin papists prompting the pope to say "If the Ephesian did not sign, we have accomplished nothing!" That St. Mark? We have learned oh so well how people with liberal leanings tend to twist history to suit their delusional worldview, but if one has a little sense of honesty and dignity it is clear to see that St. Mark of Ephesus would and is now condemning P. Bartholomew and all of his bishops for their capitulation to Rome, and her heresies. They call Rome their "sister church", holding joint prayers with them and aiding them in their attempt to destroy the Orthodox Church. Some men look at Marx and see a murderer and hater of Christ while others see a revolutionary who tried to save mankind! Maybe you are of the latter camp?
Steve11/21/2021 7:10 am
Raphael: Um, yes, Godwin's Law is victorious once again. Reductio ad Hitlerum. Everyone I don't like is Hitler.
James11/21/2021 5:41 am
Are you people serious? You literally would have condemned St. Mark of Ephesus for going to a Council with the Pope in Florence.
Raphael 11/20/2021 5:47 pm
David: What point is it that my post "illustrates"? You seem to be wanting us to feel sorry for you because you choose to continue to defend the un-orthodox behavior of P.B.! You appeal to the personal treatment he gave you in the meeting you had with him, but we look at his behavior as the "first without equals" title that he dares to use without shame, and we see a man who has complete disregard about the consequences his actions have on the body of Christ (the Church). We judge him with righteous judgment as our Lord Jesus Christ Himself commands (John 7:24), as well as by His fruit, which is the fruit of Christian blood being shed in Ukraine because of his betrayal of Christ's people for the sake of money, and global ambitions! You feel sorry for yourself, but do you feel sorry for the Orthodox Christians of Ukraine that are being beaten, attacked, MURDERED while their Church buildings are being forcefully taken by the group that your patriarch created and embolden? ARE THEY YOUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS? Apparently P. Bartholomew does not consider their pain and suffering of any importance, and it appears that he must NOT consider them his brothers and sisters! Read these words of the Holy Lord Jesus Christ: "The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly. I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep. But a hireling, he who is not the shepherd, one who does not own the sheep, sees the wolf coming and leaves the sheep and flees; and the wolf catches the sheep and scatters them. The hireling flees because he is a hireling and DOES NOT CARE ABOUT THE SHEEP.(!)" John 10:10-13. In addition to all of the things I previously listed about the Phanar's behavior it is also clear that he does NOT care about the sheep of Christ, and has no concern about how his behavior affects the body of Christ! He is extremely loving and friendly with the Latin Papists, while he and his bishops have a reputation of intolerance, rage, vengeance and HATE against any priest, monk or lay person in his own archdiocese that dares to adhere to the authentic spiritual traditions of the Church! Look at how they persecuted Elder Ephraim, and his spiritual children! To this day they label the traditionally minded believers within their own jurisdiction as "Ephraimites"! This, along with all of his other un-christian and un-pastoral behavior should seriously cause you to consider why you are defending such a character. The President of Turkey decided that P.B. would become the so called "all holiness", and the president of Turkey will decide who the next Patriarch of -the nonexistent- Constantinople will be! Think about that for a minute. A Muslim extremist will decide who the next "first without equals" will be! Finally, let me leave you with this thought: When Lord Mottistone returned from a meeting with the Fuhrer (Adolf Hitler), he enthusiastically gave his unqualified praise to the murderous dictator, informing parliament during a debate in 1935 that “all of us who have seen this remarkable man are agreed that he is absolutely truthful, sincere and unselfish“ Sir John Foster Fraser who was given an hour long audience with Hitler wrote to his British readers that “they (the Germans) honour him for his Spartan life, his lack of personal vanity, with no pleasure except architecture and music, a bachelor, a non-smoker, a teetotaller and a vegetarian.” We can now look back at history and say that Sir John and Lord Mottistone WERE BOTH WRONG and were very bad judges of character! Hitler is today known as one of the most brutal dictators the world has ever witnessed, not because of his personal treatment towards his guests but because of his "fruit"! Please read Matthew 7:15-20. May God help you!
Mikhail11/20/2021 3:58 pm
No David...the real difference between you and I is this. You have decided to defend your bishops...who repeatedly support heresy and schism. I have waited patiently for them to offer some semblance of repentance and humility for their church destroying words and actions...but alas...it is not forthcoming. It is insulting that you continually appear on various blogs as their cheerleader. PS...Don't fool yourself, many are leaving your church because of the horrific actions of your bishops.
David11/20/2021 2:50 pm
Raphael: Your post, along with the fact that you don't think I am Orthodox illustrates my point.
David11/20/2021 10:16 am
Mikhail: I would hope that in 5 years the whole atmosphere of conversation will be different. Here is the difference between you and I----I am willing to give my bishop(s) the benefit of the doubt. They aren't your bishops, so perhaps you don't care. We do. Those are our communities, our hierarchs, and priests. President Eisenhower in America had that as a creed in his relation with others (in the Army and in Politics): "Question a man's judgement, never his motives." Maybe the Ecumenical Patriarchate made a tragic mistake in Ukraine. That is certainly a possibility (that is for the Church at large to decide, not one person or Patriarchate) But all of the nasty stuff that people say about HAH Bartholomew? Well, that just isn't my experience. Have you met him? I have. My experience was different, and dear friends who have spent a significant amount of time around him have good things to say about him also. By every account I have heard, Archbishop Elpidophoros is also a kind and considerate man, willing to dialogue (he certainly didn't have to take that meeting with Metropolitan Hilarion a year or so ago---awkward picture, but a demonstration of character). I am not defending bad decisions that are made. I am defending the character of people who are unfairly maligned in these types of articles----"collateral damage" in the drive to "be right." It isn't just the Ecumenical Patriarch who takes the blow when these types of articles are written. If the EP is so horrible, what does it say about people who remain in their Churches? The subtle and not so subtle disdain and "Why haven't you already joined ROCOR?" "Bartholomew is a heretic! You're a fool for staying" attitudes can be clearly seen. That's fine if you think the EP is wrong. He is a man, not a monster or the "Patriarch of our Century." You are not seeing me and those of us in EP parishes at all. Real people are affected by this kind of rhetoric. It sows division. In fact, some parishes in the diaspora have already split because of it. It's easy to blame Patriarch Bartholomew, just as it was easy to blame Trump for everything (or now blaming Biden for everything). But we all bear some responsibility, I think. Some more than others. Are we not brothers and sisters? Is this the spirit that we want to cultivate?
Raphael 11/20/2021 12:05 am
To David: from reading your comments, to me it appears, that it is you who likes to make assumptions about all people who dare speak up against P. Bartholomew's behavior and innovations. You are the one that seems to like to falsely accuse and judge every one of us as people who are merely hoping that P. B would “go away“. You refuse to acknowledge the fact that we have been praying for his soul, and for his return to authentic orthodox Christianity rather than the innovations and modernity that he crept into the church under the false banner of “love”, and “humanism”. Why would any orthodox Christian hope that a patriarch of the church would simply “go away”? You should be asking yourself this question. it is not that we wish that any person of the church would “go away”, what we do wish is that heresy, humanism, modernity, pro-homosexuality, weak mindedness, worldliness, globalism, orchestrating of SCHISM and all of the other satanic innovations that P. Bartholomew has come to represent would be removed from the church and would completely -not just “gone away”- but destroyed, because they are the devils ATTEMPTS to destroy the church! Yes, by the grace of the Holy Lord Jesus Christ (whom your patriarch dares to fight in fighting the church’s teachings and the Lord’s saints) the church will not be destroyed but the devil is CONSTANTLY TRYING very hard to destroy Her, and it is through your patriarch that he is conducting a great amount of his wicked warfare against the Holy Church! This is how we see it, and no twisting of our words, spinning or misrepresentation of our holy orthodox position will change that truth to suit your false narrative! Stop being a defender of heresy, and come back to Orthodoxy for your soul’s sake!
Andrew 11/19/2021 10:11 pm
David, the Anglican Church does have a head, whoever is the reigning monarch at the time. At present Queen Elizabeth II.
sherlock_holmes11/19/2021 7:51 pm
We might not be here in 5 years, there are so many black clouds in the sky. Elder Efrem ( the Apostle of America ) said that after some global events, it will be a pan-Orthodox synod , and unity, and all the issues solved for a while. Patience needed !
Rufus11/19/2021 5:52 pm
David, thank you for you comments here. The "Federation" model of ecclesiology, while completely erroneous, is unfortunately how most Orthodox Christians experience their "Orthodoxy". Yet time will eventually show that the "Federation" model is completely heretical. As you said, we are not Anglicans.
Mikhail11/19/2021 5:09 pm
David...you have been an apologists for P. Bartholomew and company for a very long time. It is rather sad to see you (and others) constantly twisting in the wind as you attempt to justify actions and statements from the CP. I will give you the five years...after which time...when your jurisdiction is either on the brink of apostasy and/or in union with Rome...then you can come and look me up.
Anonymous11/19/2021 3:42 pm
David, I completely agree. It seems that "news" on this website is aimed only at pointing a finger at the EP when there are so many good and true Christians just trying to get by. Why jump from the boiling pot into a frying pan? There are issues in all churches now and what MP chooses not to acknowledge is that when they are pointing a finger at the EP, how many fingers are pointing back to them. The MP is still involved with the WCC and how is it that they have just swept under the rug the meeting in Cuba with the Pope? Pretty funny that our Gospel reading recently was about hypocrisy!
David11/19/2021 11:54 am
Ioann: the Church cannot be destroyed. Calling it nomsense doesn't make it so. Read the actual texts, including Archbishop Elpidophoros' "offending text". It doesn't say what you think it does. It is part of a long back and forth between the EP and MP on Ecclesiology, Primacy, et al. Ripping lines out context makes for good politics, but is a rotten apple in Church matters.
Ioann11/19/2021 10:34 am
David, were are you getting such nonsense? From your Vatican-trained hierarchs? And if people want Pat. Bartholomew gone, well, there are good reasons--he is destroying our Church. Of course the Catholics are quite happy to have him around because he is playing into their hand.
Mila Jovanovic11/19/2021 4:25 am
Not much more is expected from ecumenists…it does not surprise me. I pray our Lord God and Saviour (Eastern Orthodox) Jesus Christ brings them back to their senses and pray the The Пресвета Богомајка forgive them for their betrayal! Слава Господу и хвала на свему☦️☦️☦️ Thanks be to The Holy Fathers for helping us differentiate who is who within the Lord’s flock.
David11/19/2021 1:27 am
Mikail: The Ukraine situation is still fluid. Let's see what happens in 5 years, and not eat each other over it anymore. As for "First Without Equals"-----that is a line that was taken out of context, and is not a "doctrine." Archbishop Elpidophoros was responding to the MP's opinion on what "the Primacy" means. The MP, in simple terms, is attempting to introduce the "federation model" into Orthodox Ecclesiology. It would have our Church structure be like the Anglicans, with the EP functioning as the Archbishop of Canterbury does. The EP, of course, pushed back hard against this notion. The Greek view is that this "federation model" is the actual innovation, and foreign to Orthodoxy. "First Without Equals" refers to particular aspects of the EP's ministry, not the man himself----and is an answer to the MP's view that the Protos is a mere "chairman." Of course, such nuance and distinctions are lost on people who have an axe to grind. That discussion is way over my head, but I will say this---we are not Anglicans.
David11/19/2021 1:13 am
To the Editor: That is appreciated. As for the "news," I am finding the pearl clutching to be a bit much. The EP sends a delegation to the Vatican every year on June 29th. There were Orthodox observers at Vatican II, and the Catholics sent a delegation to the Crete Council. Not to mention all of the other conferences and events that the EP participates in with the WCC, FOR YEARS. No "Unia" has happened. This type of speech is boilerplate at these types of events (as well as participation in general), which is why the OCA and Serbs were there also. The only people who are reading "deeply" into it are those who already think the EP is going to become Catholic any day now. These same folks like to "connect" the dots and they continue speaking like its going to happen. Wishful thinking on their part, I think----because they want HAH Bartholomew and the EP gone, and since they can't "get rid of him" any other way, they stoke this fantasy that he is going to leave. He isn't, and I think people know that. It makes for ratings though.
Panagiotis11/18/2021 11:45 pm
First there is a conservative website called "church militant" that is run by conservative catholic individuals, and you may want to take a look at this website and see what they are saying, and you may be shocked at what you read...... Second, it looks like the Archbishop was the leader of the Orthodox delegation, you know the one that marched with BLM.... I was taught never to criticize a Priest or Bishop as they may put a curse on you. But I do not consider this one to be an Authentic Holy Orthodox Bishop....just my humble opinion as an Orthodox Christian.........
Mikhail11/18/2021 7:13 pm
Well David...I will say that there are certainly good and pious Greek Orthodox clergy and laity in this world. In America it is the monastics, clergy, and laity affiliated with the monasteries of Geronta Ephraim who are propping up the Church. But I will say this much. If you support EP Bartholomew's schism in Ukraine and the innovative doctrine of the EP and AB regarding "First without equals"...then I am not in communion with you.
Editor11/18/2021 7:12 pm
David, I have to agree. Sometimes our sarcasm gets the best of us. There are many people in the CP whom we respect and would by no means wish to estrange. Of course, however, news is news.
Simon Wiesenthal 2.011/18/2021 6:07 pm
The same USCCB that tried to have Baltimore's police department arrest Catholic protestors for drawing attention to their homosexual and pedophile bishops telling people to get abortions and Covid-19 jabs. This is the kind of "intimacy" the Church can do without.
Steve11/18/2021 5:49 pm
It appears the false union has already happened. I did some due diligence and checked the websites of all the churches involved here. Without exception, all of them say they believe in "one,holy, catholic, and apostolic Church".
Lourdes Delavega11/18/2021 5:22 pm
It is a shameful meeting of Apostates, would be apostates, schismatics and fellow travelers. I feel sorry that there is even some one who dares to defend the meeting and of course Bart. And Elpi who are the visible head of the Ecumenical snake that has entered the Orthodox Church. The time has come that the laity demand a Pan Orthodox Council to deal with these scoundrels , their heretical Ecumenical Doctrines and their concelebration of schismatics,LGBT 'churches', the Ukrainian Fraud,etc. If we don't these snakes will destroy most of the Church as it is destroying its hierarchy. We are called to act against heresy and there is none greater. May we have the awareness and strength to heed that call TODAY
Panagiotis11/18/2021 3:55 pm
The Orthodox Bishops should not have attended this function.... This is more ecumenical movement nonsense... The ecumenical movement is part of the so-called interfaith movement which is paving the way for the arrival of the false messiah, i.e. the antichrist,... Will the Orthodox Bishops next go to an assembly of a protestant sect? Maybe they can shake hands with one of the so-called "woman bishops"? What a joke....
David11/18/2021 3:24 am
Of course, Abp. Elpidophoros made sure to praise Patriarch Bartholomew, the personal focal point of the Patriarchate of Constantinople’s mission in the world." Who wrote this ugly line? People rightly get upset when know-nothing pundits write such nonsense about the Moscow Patriarchate ("their mission in the world" being to promote Russian hegemony) so why is this type of rhetoric acceptable on a website of one of our monasteries? When you write this stuff, you are not only insulting Patriarch Bartholomew (which is red meat for certain folks), but also many good people who labor for the Gospel under the banner of the Ecumenical Patriarchate. EP laity are constantly thrown under the bus with lines like this, and all MP partisans can do when confronted is hem and haw and disingenuously say that they aren't "talking about us." But you are talking about us. We who are, at least "in theory" your Orthodox brothers and sisters. The Church of Constantinople is more than just Patriarch Bartholomew and the Court in the Phanar. The Ecumenical Patriarchate is more than just the man, just as the Moscow Patriarchate is (and how many Russians during Soviet Times remained "loyal" to it while disdaining the man and/or actions coming from it). I actually really enjoy your edifying articles, which is why I have struggled to stick around here. As a Church sponsored website, I would say you have a responsibility to be better than this. "They did it first!" is probably one of the poorest defenses one can offer, particularly before the Great Judgement Seat.
Warcasle11/18/2021 1:53 am
The only consolation I can draw from the article is that in the photo my Bishop doesn't look too happy to be there...
Mary11/17/2021 11:41 pm
God help us all. Lord have mercy.
Alexander Leitner11/17/2021 9:56 pm
What a shame for the Serbian Hierarch! Shame on him.
Mikhail11/17/2021 7:32 pm
Brother bishops and sister churches? Is this heretical yet...or do we wait for more?
Utrecht11/17/2021 7:04 pm
Glory be to God! The confusion of last year is breaking - the 'well we can compromise' will become so obvious, we must either be Orthodox, or apostates. God in His mercy is making it very, very clear whom are Orthodox, and who say so in name only. We are blessed to live in such a time as we WEEK and SOFT and COMFORTABLE Orthodox Christians may suffer for His name. As St Paisios, Elder Ephraim has said. It is becoming very clear to know who is apostate. May God have mercy on Archbishop Elpidophoros, and keep the faithful safe from heresy.
Here you can leave your comment on the present article, not exceeding 4000 characters. All comments will be read by the editors of OrthoChristian.Com.
Enter through FaceBook
Your name:
Your e-mail:
Enter the digits, seen on picture:

Characters remaining: 4000

to our mailing list

* indicates required